Haley Gone? This would be good...
Cali-Steeler
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#1
01-16-2018, 01:33 AM

Not sure this would happen, but would be good -



Thread > https://247sports.com/nfl/pittsburgh-ste...-113731301
(This post was last modified: 01-16-2018, 01:36 AM by Cali-Steeler.)
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Chucktownsteeler
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#2
01-16-2018, 03:22 AM

Randy Fitchner has ties to Tomlin all the way back to their days at Memphis and the Memphis spread offense. Would be a good move (IMHO).


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Rollers
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#3
01-16-2018, 07:52 AM

Every single time you see a QB on the other team come off the field he talks to the offensive coordinator. Even Brady when he's not screaming at him. whatever else is going on this has to change. Why didn't Ben simply audible to a sneak? I have no clue
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Chucktownsteeler
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#4
01-16-2018, 07:59 AM

(01-16-2018, 07:52 AM)Rollers Wrote: Every single time you see a QB on the other team come off the field he talks to the offensive coordinator.  Even Brady when he's not screaming at him.  whatever else is going on this has to change.  Why didn't Ben simply audible to a sneak?  I have no clue

That is a question I asked myself as well. Ben should just have snuck it. Maybe he has audibled in the past and had his tweeter spanked. 

Believe me I work with idiots everyday and after awhile you become numb to it.


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sandfan
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#5
01-16-2018, 08:31 AM

The only coach that has come on board in the last few years and made a positive contribution is Munchak. The issue is not only Haley or any other coach currently in place. The core of the problem lies at the top with Tomlin. And yes I know, he's never had a losing season.
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Chucktownsteeler
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#6
01-16-2018, 08:47 AM

(01-16-2018, 08:31 AM)sandfan Wrote: The only coach that has come on board in the last few years and made a positive contribution is Munchak.  The issue is not only Haley or any other coach currently in place.  The core of the problem lies at the top with Tomlin.  And yes I know, he's never had a losing season.

And Munchak is rumored to be a candidate for the Cards HC position.


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bbbooger
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#7
01-16-2018, 08:49 AM

"The issue is not only Haley or any other coach currently in place. The core of the problem lies at the top with Tomlin. And yes I know, he's never had a losing season."

^^ THIS! I have literally no hope for another championship under any form of the current regime. Pains me greatly to see a once-in-a-generation QB's career wasted.
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bksteeler
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#8
01-16-2018, 10:52 AM

Be careful what you wish for.

Hopefully, though, it would be a good change. We definitely need a QB and OC on the same page, and better play calling in critical situations would be good. But that's as much on Tomlin as on anyone else.

The good with Haley:

1. Sacks and hits were way down on his watch, and Ben is healthier for it. Had Arians stayed in, Ben would probably be a cripple.

2. Related to number one, he taught Ben the benefit of quicker releases. As time went by, Ben got better at knowing when to hold on and when to let go. The offense is a lot more efficient as a result. Too often in the past, he would take bad sacks that would break up a drive. I remember in the beginning everyone complaining about Ben dinking and dunking that first year or two under Haley. But as time has gone on, Ben's deep game came back to balance it out. And for all the crap Haley's taken, some deserved, he gave us a team that averaged 400 points over the last several years. This from a team that never did that but twice before, in 1979 and 1995. And this also with lesser defense than Arians and others had to work with. I always "loved" Arians' line on not changing Ben's style: "Way back I tried to change a QB's style, and it destroyed his career. I don't want to do that with Ben." I think it's fair to say that Ben is a better quarterback now than he was under Arians.

The bad.

1. Really bad play-calling at times, particularly in the redzone and short yardage. But Arians was bad at that too. Weird personnel groupings at critical times.

2. Unlike Arians, bad relationships with QB and possibly others. And that's what is ultimately going to cost him his job.

What I really want to see though is a change at DC. Let's face it, I had no confidence going in our defense going into these playoffs. When I heard Heyward and Mitchell talking during the bye-week about "cleaning up" things, I rolled my eyes. They had ALL season to "clean up" their miscommunications and mistakes and never did it. Why would it suddenly clean up with a bye.

That's on the DC. At least with Haley, the offense got better as the year went on. But with Butler, the defense regressed. And don't give me the injury excuse. This has nothing to do with the injuries. Everyone deals with injuries, including key ones. Anyone want to tell me that the Patriots have better personnel than the Steelers defensively even with Shazier out? Why do the Patriots do better? They're better at "doing their job."

The players continually failed to do their job the entire second half of the year, despite all the talk of "cleaning up things." After this game, they were still talking about the same things they had all year. But now there's no time left in this season to clean things up. It's done. It's over.

I know that Butler probably stays, but I think Lake has to go. Loved him as a player, but he's done nothing to help our secondary guys. Our d-line and linebacker coaches have done better at developing people, but they gotta do a better job of making people do their job. And if they can't do that, they gotta go too.

And Tomlin, focus on situational football...please. And less gut, more brains. Your gut costs us too many games. And focus your team on the next matchup. No more talk of possible matchups in the future.

This is the worst playoff loss than the Tebow game. I'm not sure which is worse. Probably the Tebow game, but same pattern, falling way behind at home, coming back, and falling short. What a waste of a season. Then and now.
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mcmillenandwife
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#9
01-16-2018, 08:58 PM

(01-16-2018, 07:59 AM)Chucktownsteeler Wrote:
(01-16-2018, 07:52 AM)Rollers Wrote: Every single time you see a QB on the other team come off the field he talks to the offensive coordinator.  Even Brady when he's not screaming at him.  whatever else is going on this has to change.  Why didn't Ben simply audible to a sneak?  I have no clue

That is a question I asked myself as well. Ben should just have snuck it. Maybe he has audibled in the past and had his tweeter spanked. 

Believe me I work with idiots everyday and after awhile you become numb to it.

Unless I misunderstood, Ben said in a postgame interview that the QB sneak hasn't been part of their playbook for some time. They haven't run one, even in practice, in several years. He went on to say something to the effect of, "I don't know why... I'd be in favor of it."
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Rollers
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#10
01-16-2018, 09:16 PM

(01-16-2018, 08:58 PM)mcmillenandwife Wrote:
(01-16-2018, 07:59 AM)Chucktownsteeler Wrote:
(01-16-2018, 07:52 AM)Rollers Wrote: Every single time you see a QB on the other team come off the field he talks to the offensive coordinator.  Even Brady when he's not screaming at him.  whatever else is going on this has to change.  Why didn't Ben simply audible to a sneak?  I have no clue

That is a question I asked myself as well. Ben should just have snuck it. Maybe he has audibled in the past and had his tweeter spanked. 

Believe me I work with idiots everyday and after awhile you become numb to it.

Unless I misunderstood, Ben said in a postgame interview that the QB sneak hasn't been part of their playbook for some time. They haven't run one, even in practice, in several years. He went on to say something to the effect of, "I don't know why... I'd be in favor of it."

while that may be true how much practice does it take to sneak?
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mcmillenandwife
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#11
01-16-2018, 10:10 PM

(01-16-2018, 09:16 PM)Rollers Wrote: while that may be true how much practice does it take to sneak?


This is the NFL. It takes practice. Everything takes practice. Details matter. 

Unfortunately, attention to detail was conspicuously absent at times with this team this year.
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Rollers
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#12
01-16-2018, 10:48 PM

(01-16-2018, 10:10 PM)mcmillenandwife Wrote:
(01-16-2018, 09:16 PM)Rollers Wrote: while that may be true how much practice does it take to sneak?


This is the NFL. It takes practice. Everything takes practice. Details matter. 

Unfortunately, attention to detail was conspicuously absent at times with this team this year.

I get it.  It's a QB sneak though   c'mon
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Chucktownsteeler
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#13
01-16-2018, 11:10 PM

I'd rather take mt chance on a "yeti" type QB, albeit unpracticed, 6' 5", (listed at) 241 lbs., on a 4th and 9 inches over an 8 yard toss sweep against one of the fastest defense in the league. I thought Tomlin said "we don't live in our fears". I think he fears Ben getting hurt and took the QB out of the book.

Even "tiny" Drews Brees ran successful QB sneaks against the Vikes last week.

As my co-worker says: "you can't fix stupid".


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mcmillenandwife
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#14
01-16-2018, 11:23 PM

Look, I'm not disagreeing that a QB sneak would've been the right call. It absolutely should've been the call. But if it's basically not even in the playbook anymore, I don't think even Ben can go that far off the reservation.
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Rollers
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#15
01-17-2018, 12:32 AM

(01-16-2018, 11:23 PM)mcmillenandwife Wrote: Look, I'm not disagreeing that a QB sneak would've been the right call. It absolutely should've been the call. But if it's basically not even in the playbook anymore, I don't think even Ben can go that far off the reservation.

our whole coaching staff has to go.  if it's not even in the playbook that speaks volumes about Tomlin and Haley.  Makes them the biggest idiots in football.  I'm sorry we don't have a QB sneak in the playbook.  Yes it's stupid but that's where we are as a team.  Coach Tomlin just retire please.  This is your team and you don't even have a QB sneak in the playbook?  Wonder how many other NFL teams can say that?  I'm betting zero.  Tim this coaching staff is suspect from the top down except for maybe the offensive line coach.  The whole group is sub standard.  Has Haley been offered a new contract yet?  He will be.  How about extending that stellar defensive coaching staff?  They will be.   On we go
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Chucktownsteeler
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#16
01-17-2018, 01:57 AM

How dangerous is a QB sneak? I've been watching football since around 1972 (yes, I'm that old) and I don't recall ever seeing a QB get hurt on a sneak.

Tomlin - "We don't live in our fears" (except QB sneaks).


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RaynorShyne
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#17
01-17-2018, 03:51 AM

(01-17-2018, 12:32 AM)Rollers Wrote:
(01-16-2018, 11:23 PM)mcmillenandwife Wrote: Look, I'm not disagreeing that a QB sneak would've been the right call. It absolutely should've been the call. But if it's basically not even in the playbook anymore, I don't think even Ben can go that far off the reservation.

our whole coaching staff has to go.  if it's not even in the playbook that speaks volumes about Tomlin and Haley.  Makes them the biggest idiots in football.  I'm sorry we don't have a QB sneak in the playbook.  Yes it's stupid but that's where we are as a team.  Coach Tomlin just retire please.  This is your team and you don't even have a QB sneak in the playbook?  Wonder how many other NFL teams can say that?  I'm betting zero.  Tim this coaching staff is suspect from the top down except for maybe the offensive line coach.  The whole group is sub standard.  Has Haley been offered a new contract yet?  He will be.  How about extending that stellar defensive coaching staff?  They will be.   On we go

49 years - 3 head coaches.  If the Rooney's got rid of Tomlin, it'd be news worthy of interrupting the Super Bowl.
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jschroe36
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#18
01-17-2018, 03:52 AM

(01-17-2018, 01:57 AM)Chucktownsteeler Wrote: How dangerous is a QB sneak? I've been watching football since around 1972 (yes, I'm that old) and I don't recall ever seeing a QB get hurt on a sneak.

Tomlin - "We don't live in our fears" (except QB sneaks).

Probably pretty rare but it happens:

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/articl...53f602c6dc
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jschroe36
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#19
01-17-2018, 03:53 AM

(01-17-2018, 03:52 AM)jschroe36 Wrote:
(01-17-2018, 01:57 AM)Chucktownsteeler Wrote: How dangerous is a QB sneak? I've been watching football since around 1972 (yes, I'm that old) and I don't recall ever seeing a QB get hurt on a sneak.

Tomlin - "We don't live in our fears" (except QB sneaks).

Probably pretty rare but it happens:

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/articl...53f602c6dc

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highl...back-sneak
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mcmillenandwife
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#20
01-17-2018, 07:08 AM

(01-17-2018, 03:53 AM)jschroe36 Wrote:
(01-17-2018, 03:52 AM)jschroe36 Wrote:
(01-17-2018, 01:57 AM)Chucktownsteeler Wrote: How dangerous is a QB sneak? I've been watching football since around 1972 (yes, I'm that old) and I don't recall ever seeing a QB get hurt on a sneak.

Tomlin - "We don't live in our fears" (except QB sneaks).

Probably pretty rare but it happens:

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/articl...53f602c6dc

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highl...back-sneak


Well, injuries on QB sneaks definitely DO happen and I'm 99.3% sure I've actually seen Ben get dinged on a sneak before.
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Chucktownsteeler
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#21
01-17-2018, 07:43 AM

When you count how many million times a randon QB has ran the sneak of the years these 2 injuries show the odds are pretty minute.


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mcmillenandwife
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#22
01-17-2018, 09:19 AM

(01-17-2018, 07:43 AM)Chucktownsteeler Wrote: When you count how many million times a randon QB has ran the sneak of the years these 2 injuries show the odds are pretty minute.

True. Probably no more or less chance of an injury than any other play.
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Rollers
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#23
01-17-2018, 09:23 PM

(01-17-2018, 07:08 AM)mcmillenandwife Wrote:
(01-17-2018, 03:53 AM)jschroe36 Wrote:
(01-17-2018, 03:52 AM)jschroe36 Wrote:
(01-17-2018, 01:57 AM)Chucktownsteeler Wrote: How dangerous is a QB sneak? I've been watching football since around 1972 (yes, I'm that old) and I don't recall ever seeing a QB get hurt on a sneak.

Tomlin - "We don't live in our fears" (except QB sneaks).

Probably pretty rare but it happens:

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/articl...53f602c6dc

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highl...back-sneak


Well, injuries on QB sneaks definitely DO happen and I'm 99.3% sure I've actually seen Ben get dinged on a sneak before.
how can you tell with ben?  Sometimes it looks like he's been shot and he gets up and walks off the field
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Crash
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#24
01-18-2018, 03:43 AM

ESPN says Haley out...
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Chucktownsteeler
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#25
01-18-2018, 04:02 AM

hallafuckingluah! Now can Butler.


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